America: Freedom to Fascism

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by ShoGun, Apr 29, 2008.

America: Freedom to Fascism

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by ShoGun, Apr 29, 2008.

  1. ShoGun

    ShoGun Guest

  2. Babmer

    Babmer Guest

    Yeah, Yeah, intresting stuff. Full of contradictions i heard.. but.. still good to keep an open mind eh?
     
  3. EonMaster

    EonMaster Eeveelution Master

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    Even before seeing these, I knew the US gov't was messed up. Many of our rights have been limited or taken away, the gov't lies to us about things we should know about (Area 51 comes to mind), and "The People" are unable to rebel against an opressive gov't like the Constitution says we can.

    Never knew that the Income Tax wasn't legal though, but like others, I'd rather pay it than have the IRS breath down my neck.
     
  4. Wlck742

    Wlck742 New Member

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    The US government is messed up? Take a look at half the countries in the world, then you'll really see what's messed up. In places like Sierra Leone, Sudan, North Korea, not only are their rights taken away, their lives as well on a day to day basis. Consider yourself lucky. And as for Area 51 and other classified information, how smart do you think it'll be to release information to the public that could set them at risk for attack? US government is great, by any standard, but it's definitely not the worst either.
     
  5. EonMaster

    EonMaster Eeveelution Master

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    I meant messed up compared to how the government's rules say it should act.

    For example, the Bill of Rights states the rights all US citizens have that government cannot intrude on. But all of the listed rights have been limited by varying degrees in the last century. The gov't is no longer a gov't "by the people, for the people". Instead it seems to cares about everyone but it's own people.

    Personally, I think the US should spend more time and money on it's own citizens instead of sending troops and billions of dollars wherever they aren't wanted, getting us into stalemate wars.

    As for secrets like Area 51, I would like to know what they're doing there to make it so secret. Also, the facility is no longer in Area 51, it was moved, but I cannot remember where.
     
  6. Hodl pu

    Hodl pu New Member

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    Insurance sucks here the US. My dental insurance dropped my coverage so I was scared of getting any dental problems. Then one day after a self paid cleaning, they found out my wisdom teeth were coming out and I wasn't covered for the operation for all 4 wisdom teeth. I had to find an insurance company for the operation, and when I did, I was only covered for 1/4 of the total costs.
     
  7. josh

    josh New Member

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    A moral government doesn't exist anymore so it doesn't matter who is seated or how the people will react to it. It will always be corrupt no matter what people do. If people does revolt and overthrow the government, the whole state or the whole country will have a really hard time getting it to how they want it to be. So go, don't pay your taxes so your money won't go to the bankers pockets and no free education will exist, no free healthcare, green parks, good roads, etc, etc.
     
  8. ijffdrie

    ijffdrie Lord of Spam

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    the main problem with america is, IMHO, that it is too big, with too many different groups, it is impossible to oversee all of america. IMHO america needs to be split in 50 different countries, although it would be impossible to split up the national debt correctly amongst the states


    p.s. i am not american so i might be wrong
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2008
  9. Ursawarrior

    Ursawarrior New Member

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    i think the philippines (mah country) comes second to a fukd up country , i mean, how corrupted can the government be?
     
  10. ijffdrie

    ijffdrie Lord of Spam

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    as corrupt as most african countries?
     
  11. Biz

    Biz New Member

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    We have a lot of groups but it has always been that way and I haven't seen any real problems come about from it. Well, at least no more than any other multi-grouped country at least.

    A split wouldn't work it's too mixed up anyways.
     
  12. Meee

    Meee New Member

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    Split would be a very, very bad idea imo. It would no longer be the powerfull USA, who knows, maybe people there would have to actually start trying? And there's no telling if some of the new countries wouldn't start fighting without the uniting factor of being in one country
     
  13. paragon

    paragon Guest

  14. TheWorker

    TheWorker Guest

    And do you think that most American people deserve democracy? Do you think that they can handle the sheer amount of responsibilities that comes with it?
    USA is messed up (as most of countries today) but I dont think it can be otherwise.

    Actually there is better version which was even aired on TV, I used to have a link but I lost all my bookmarks recently, Ill try to find it.
     
  15. ijffdrie

    ijffdrie Lord of Spam

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    there are worse countries, but at least they dont pretend to be free(well, actually, some do, but those are not known as the country of freedom) Americans are too americoistic to care about the rest of the world and only hear what they want to(the common american, i mean, there are exeptions, and in many europian countries it is that way, but somehow(i dont exactly know why) the politici there are not as stupid and self-loving that they see their selves as the big example for teh world(except for the french, and het vlaams front)
     
  16. paragon

    paragon Guest

    Thats because Europe is no longer willing or able to handle the responsibility of the problems of the world outside of the European Union without America's lead. While this is more from the 90s it has carried into more recent times. Case in point, the Bosnian War and Kosovo War. Despite knowing that ethnic cleaning was happening right there in eastern Europe, none of the European countries wanted to take the lead to do anything about the situation. It was the United States that had to take the lead and get NATO moving in order to end those conflicts. Europe is probably in part afraid of their imperialist past and in part used to the United States taking the lead as they did throughout the Cold War.
     
  17. MeisterX

    MeisterX Hyperion

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    While I think these videos are interesting and raise some valuable points, especially about the method of taxation (I thought the numbers of 297 billion in annual revenue from corporate taxation versus 900 something billion from average Americans extremely unfair considering that one or two corporations would out pace the combined annual income of all average Americans combined), I don't think this argument is entirely true.

    I think that the Constitutional rights declared by the Constitution for the Government in methods of taxation are probably a bit outdated and the methods of taxing common people are for the most part fair because of the fact that we have access to direct representation. However, I do feel that more of the burden for federal revenue should be placed upon the upper class, specifically gigantic corporations like Microsoft, Exxon-Mobile, BP, etc, because of their immense profits of which less than 5% is taxed.

    In further argument of this point, many of these large corporations are owned in majority by foreign investors, like Saudi Arabians or the Japanese, and not taxing these companies in fair part is wasting GDP. Overall I think it unfair when I'm making less than $3000 a year and am taxed 20% (because I technically run my own business) and I see no tax return. Meanwhile certain Corporations are bringing in tens of billions of dollars and being taxed 5%. That's outrageous. Their percentage rate should be MUCH higher than mine. Let's flip those rates, shall we?

    We should continue to pay taxes, but the middle and lower class should not be the primary burden animals of the American government system. Let's target those who have benefited from our policies of free trade, free speech, and self-motivation. The American dream should be funded by those who have already experienced it, not by those still striving for it.

    As far as foreign investment of our military assets, I think far more care should be taken in selecting potential targets. It's painfully clear to me that the Iraq war was undertaken for the wrong reasons and was not thought through, else we would at LEAST have a clearer picture of what is going on the country. If so many military experts, including Colin Powell, have a problem with the plan that was brought in, then clearly that was not a good choice. On the other hand, Afghanistan was and still is a very justified action and should have been pursued to the fullest without the distraction that Iraq has provided. The justification for Afghanistan, "The War on Terror" does not spill over into Iraq, period.

    America is clearly doing something right because we have been on top of the world pollitically, financially, and culturally for the last twenty years and while our position does seem to be dwindling somewhat with the appearance of China on the global market as a serious competitor. I think we need to change and there's a serious issue in programs in the U.S. that need to be reformed badly (tax structure, healthcare, insurance), but we're doing so many things right at the same time (not education).

    If we can educate the masses, and help to educate the global population, while pursuing technological solutions to the crises we find ourselves looking at (as mankind has always faced) we will eventually pull through to find the next brink of extinction to avert. I've always believed Space exploration to be a viable solution for these types of problems (how do you think things like aluminum foil, microwave technology, digital communications were developed?) on a global scale.

    We'll always persevere, our job is just to keep America as the central place for that to happen.
     
  18. NiTeSkY

    NiTeSkY New Member

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    Ok! Here's How it is. Freedom - "We Had" Founding Fathers said right to bear arms. They didn't got to specific and say right to bear musket. They didn't want the constitution to be considered "OUTDATED" which, by now 90% of the people have been convinced by the people who are supposed to be our "SERVANTS" and justifiers of the constitution have convinced us. Why in the world do people believe the government? These people in D.C. are our servants. They are just there to say what we told them to say, or do what we told them to do. If you dont believe in the upcoming crash of the dollar, or the upcoming world government owned and ran by the U.N. then you're an idiot. Just go to YouTube and look at some Ron Paul Videos and educate yourselves cause if you don't; America, "your supposedly Free and Perfect country" is doomed and the American people are to blame. Put down your TV Guide and Your doughnuts for just a minute and go to google! or YouTube. Look up Ziteghiest or even the rap song by immortal technique will educate. People can do something about this if they would stop worrying about who's going home on American idol tonight. I sat screw TV. Internet is the only thing free on this planet, But not for long. Running Linux instead of helping Microsoft will keep your precious internet free. If your worried about SC not being compatable to Linux then think again. There are ways to save us people if you would just ****ing listen, SCREW THE ENVIORNMENT.... Its a political sham to get rid of GOD and any other Competition to the leaders of the world... Please America... SPREAD THE WORD!!!! and stay alert, QUESTION YOUR GOVERNMENT. we own them. If a cop stops you and says you cant skatebooard here or something that you have the right to do. Tell him to make you a cupcake and get the **** out of your face. ty gg! i have spoken, All you have to do is listen :)
     
  19. Biz

    Biz New Member

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    Less drugs kthnx.
     
  20. NiTeSkY

    NiTeSkY New Member

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    Never said that ;)
    Could improve your smarts some though!