could anyone give me some tips as when and how to rush with protos?

Discussion in 'Protoss' started by Jebof, Nov 29, 2010.

could anyone give me some tips as when and how to rush with protos?

Discussion in 'Protoss' started by Jebof, Nov 29, 2010.

  1. Jebof

    Jebof New Member

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    im just a bronze league player, and i sometimes try to rush my oponent, but i don't really know how to do this and when to do this, i dont mean cannon rush, i mean simmple unit rush, i would apreciate any kind of advice , thanks in advance.
     
  2. Stirlitz

    Stirlitz Member

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    First off, you can either rush for an army(And that means apply pressure early game, and aim for either a fast win or a crippling attack to your opponent's economy so you get the upper hand) or rush for some tech that will again either win you the game or give you some specific strategic advantage.

    For example: You can rush for DTs and depending on your opponents scouting there are 3 possibile outcomes:
    -(He scouts it very early and) attacks you when you are vulnerable(about when the shrine is halfway complete) and you'll prolly lose
    -(He scouts it in time to make detection and) has detection ready, but he has to have mobile detection to move out of his base, so you've effectively contained him in his base or base+expo and so can get the upper hand by expanding more than him and increase your chances of winning the late game or
    -(He scouts it late/doesn't see it coming and) you catch him unprepared with no detection and get a fast gg out of him.

    Then there's the korean 4gate push, where you build 4 gates with a specific timing to have them complete as soon as your warpgate tech is done and only mine enough gas for the warpgate tech and swarm your opponents with many zealots very early in-game. From that you can modify your strategy to either commit to pushing and spend all your money there leading you to either victory or death by lack of resources or stop attacking, tech and expand and transition to a gate-heavy army(likely templar, chargelots etc).


    The basic thing to have in mind when rushing is that it requires a very tight build. It's both good and bad practice for 2 reasons: Good because practicing rushes tightens up your build(You try to make them more effective and faster and cut off the fat from your build making you better in the early game), but it usually ends the game fast, therefore depriving you from practice of the mid and late game which is something that you need to know.


    Now, how to do the basics of a rush as a general rule(Before going into specific builds): Say you want to rush for a specific tech. List the buildings/tech needed for that and only make the minimum amout of buildings required to reach that tech and the minimum amount of units required so you don't get delayed by resource shortage. Practice it and review what you did checking your resources: If you for example were short on gas when you wanted that tech out, you might want to add an assimilator earlier than you did and possible replace some stalker or sentry in your early army with a couple of zealots. Try it again, and review your progress and that's how you practice a rush.

    Let's take an example of a DT rush:
    You need: A dark shrine, which needs a citadel of adun(or what's the name of it in sc2 I keep forgetting >.<) which needs a cyber core which needs a gateway.
    So after getting your gateway your focus will be building a fast core, a fast citadel{the thing with charge anyway} and a fast shrine. This means that you will need lots of gas for this(shrine costs 250, cita costs 100, 50 for warpgate tech adds up to 400, not counting the units you'll need for defense) so you should probably get both geysers up pretty fast. And you start by building on ly the required buildings and spending excess money into units for protection. You might also skip the warpgate tech till after the shrine starts building so you can get an extra sentry out to force field your ramp, there are things you can play around with and with trial-and-error decide what feels best for you.

    This is how you make your own rushes: You decide what kind of unit or tech you want and how fast and you go for it, while trying to keep yourself safe.

    On rushing for a fast army it works a little different: Here you make production buildings and get a feel on how many you can support producing all the time with the amount of workers you have at a given time. If you make 1 gate and keep pumping out units from it you'll easily realise that you are having too much money. If you make 5 fast gates and try to pump units from all you'll also realise easily that you can't support that many. So, depending on how much pressure you want to apply and what kind of tech you want to transition to, you might want to opt for 2-4 gateways, 4 being the most a single base can keep producing out of.


    Now, all this is about how to decide for yourself how to make a rush and what kind of rush to make. There are specific strategies and builds that are made with maximum efficiency in mind(Which means:how many workers on minerals, how many workers on gas, if and when to cut worker production if it's gonna be an all-in type of strat, when to build which building so you can time your upgrades/buildings/income to line up for the best push etc) but even knowing these strategies, it takes practice to pull them through. These build orders are a product of either the way I told you above(trial and error), simulations or pencil and paper work making a time/resource/building/army table.


    Anyway, to finish this with a few example video guides on various protoss rushes or early aggressive builds:

    1)Dark Templar Rush
    2)2gate Void Ray(Not VR rush since you sacrifice some VR time for a little more army out of the second gate for safety)
    3)Korean 4Gate(This is the zealot-only all-in build and has some specific worker production sacrifices to maximize time-efficiency)
    4)Proxy-gate into 4gate
    5)4gate timing push I didn't watch this but if it is what I think it is it should be a gas-heavier variation of the korean 4gate build, which is slower and applies less pressure but has more transition options.
    6)MOTHERSHIP RUSH!!: This is a fun strat an extremely vulnerable early-game, but against a non-suspecting opponent it might work, lol. I've had success with it 2 times out of 2 I used it, once against a platinum friend of mine yesterday, so you can never know, lol :p If it works you get a laugh, worth the risk, lol :p
    7)Fast 1base blink stalkers against Zerg: A best-of-3 between idra and nazgul where nazgul went for the same strat all 3 times and managed to pull of a 2-1 victory against idra. very effective strat against zerg it seems...


    To close this, I'd like to advice you not to focus too much on rushing your enemies and try to learn the mid and late-game too, since rushing only practices the early-game and doing too much of it generally makes your mid-to-late game play a little sloppy. But it's still good practice for that tightening up your build and shouldn't be neglected either.
    Hope it covered what you were looking for...

    Cheers and gl! :)
     
  3. Jebof

    Jebof New Member

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    dude thanks alot this was way more than what i was expecting, u really really helped me, im gonna try all ur tips, and some of this strategies, this is like the best guide i've ever seen ever, thanks!
     
  4. Jebof

    Jebof New Member

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    really thanks for both of you guys, could any of you care to tell me how to upload a replay? so that u can watch it if you got the time and tell me what went wrong, and what else should i have done better?
     
  5. Stirlitz

    Stirlitz Member

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    In the quick reply below press "go advanced" and below the box where you write the text is another box with options. Select "Manage Attachments" and pick the replays you want... You can upload up to a max number(5 or 10 I think, not sure)...
     
  6. Jebof

    Jebof New Member

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  7. Ste

    Ste New Member

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    If I see someone going for a very early expansion then I zealot rush it. Otherwise I just rush out units to counter early scouted agression.
     
  8. Yonkid

    Yonkid New Member

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    If you're getting warpgates - and it's early game, get a few zealots or stalkers out. If you go stalker-wise, get blink and if you go zealot-wise, get charge. You would want to commence an attack the second you warp out a group of units - because it's not like terran, where you build units 1 by 1, it's a burst of units, so you need to attack immediatly after a warp.

    In case of 2 gate 1 robo, you might want to attack as soon as you get your first collosus, or better when you get thermal lance out and 1-2 collosus, a few stalkers and zealots.
     
  9. Ste

    Ste New Member

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    Charging out 3-4 zealots asap and running right into their mineral line can often times give you a good advantage if not a outright win in pvp.

    Just make you scout for counter proxies.
     
  10. Lewan

    Lewan New Member

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    Do the 4 gate rush - its basically what it sounds like, get 4 warp gates fast and then rush them .
    Go to --->http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GpvL5YYPFgc for a detailed step by step tutorial. This is a nice strategy that works at all skill level. Also this isn't an all out attack so if your rush fails u can transition easily into the mid game.