Religion

Dont you people get it? Its pointless to discuss this topic. Religious people wont stop believeng beacause of logic and if they do, they probably didnt really believe in the first place.

 

OF course there are flaws =3
there are flaws in scientific laws as well. Nothing is set in stone. We think the law of gravity is always as it is, but there is no "rule" that dictates it. Suddenly everythign could float upward =O
Rules are not created, they are attempts to understand things. therefore, nothing is wihtout flaws, why would religion be an exception? ^-^

 

"Nothing is without flaws"?! .
Forgive me but i thought that 'God' is flawless? for he is said to be omnipotent and omniscient?

Aye, you're probobly right.

 

Well, I was under the impression that you didn't believe in him.
And...this may be agaisnt a basis of my religion, but i think even perfection can have it's flaws ^-^

 

Aha, well , i was talking from your point of view ^^. Nice to hear your opinions on the subject tho.

 

Thanks, it's good to discuss this. and I agree, Worker. But, it is interesting to see how much people can believe everything ^-^
Yes, i SHOULD believe God is perfect, because I'm catholic. But, i have way too much trouble believing anythign can be completely perfect unless perfection has its own flaws. It doens;t make sense, but from how I see it, it does. Maybe that's just my insanity, but that's what I believe ^-^

 

Im sure IF God is real that he would respect your opinion anyway

 

a note about free will versus omniscient. this is an often brought up contradiction, and the responsemost oftentimes is that it is not that god FORCES you to choose what you do (hence free will), just that god KNOWS the choice you will make. if have knowledge that the moon rotates around the earth, it does not mean that i am forcing it do so.

personally, religion is a very confusing topic. i very much disagree with those that say logic cant be applied, or that science and religion contradict.

 

Thanks Babmer, please just don;t stress the "if". I knwo what you mean and thank you, but a slgiht bit of me feels as if it were being mocked ^-^
Not that i mind, i am quite used to it and okay with it. You jsut don;t strike me as a person who would do that so just telling you =3

And i think religion and science can intertwine. They have been using science to try and prove/disprove religion a long time. But, when you look at it, the whole purpose of religion is for people to believe what they will out of their own choosing. Because if it can all be proven, then it's not really a religion [a belief] but a fact. It takes little to no faith to believe a fact, and if there is a God, i believe he would want us to choose to trust/beleive in him, not to force us all to know and see it.

 

There is an evolutionary need in most humans to have religion. There is even a set of genes which predispose you to be religious, logic has nothing to it....

 

Woah nonono i wasnt mocking anything, Just talking from my pov of not being too sure if hes real tis all.

 

I know, that's why i said just be careful. Some people will take it full out that way. I'm perfectly fine with you not being sure. I have a very close agnostic friend and he's one of the coolest guys I know. Overall. I think religion is important, but over here in the West it doesn;t seem like such a big deal. Unlike places liks china, over here religion is just a rough basis, not a way of life.

So, I don't really think it matters what people believe. It's all persepective, i s'pose, that's what makes religion such a debatable topic.

 

Proof?

 

God...

Sorry for bringing religion up again, but I was thinking about religion too much and I have to talk about and start arguing... I just want some answers.

Don't get me wrong, I respect your beliefs but I just think its... well... awkward.

You worship something you've never seen, never met, never heard... Do you even know God exists?

 

Religion, by definition, is belief and trust in something whose existence you can't prove. So it's virtually pointless to argue whether or not God exists, because in the end, we can't prove it. Besides, this is probably a duplicate topic.

 

... Well I'm a Buddist, and we warship the buddha to follow his/her steps in peace. Buddha isn't really a god, and we shouldn't call them gods, its not really right but w/e. For seeing the god or w/e its been past down from generrations, get it? or the god or w/e can be communicated through signs or visions (Dreams, Meditation images or w/e)

 

unreasonable people will say that "what about the wind? we cant see the wind but we know it exists"
DEAD WRONG!
wind exists because of force, although not visually, it still exists >just a info...

soooo...... anyways, "the gods" only exists in our minds... we have them to inspire us and to follow the right ways
THEY ONLY EXIST TO GUIDE US! AND BE AN INSPIRATION! AND THEY AREN'T EXCUSES TO BEAT OURSELVES BECAUSE OF THE SINS THAT WE'VE DONE AND SUCH.....

 

Duplicate thread merged.

Also, I found that question a bit bold coming from Darktemplar_L. Didn't you believe in the paranormal despite never seeing it, meeting it or hearing it? I'm not trying to insult you or anything, but isn't it pretty much the exact same scenario?

 

Darktemplar that's the whole point.
I don't know how it's literaly in english but there's even a saying, something like "Blessed who didn't see and believed"


btw. Isn't it still a duplicate topic?

 

Some more arguments:


"Nature and reality are congruent words, nature is reality, reality is nature. All that exists is real, and all that is real exists. Everything that is real is governed by nature, it is nature. From every dimension, to every black hole, hypernova, solar flare and gravity. If something does not exist, it is not real. Therefore if it exists, it becomes part of reality, ergo nature.

So if something "supernatural," were to exist, by its own definition is illogical and non-existant, it would no longer be "supernatural," merely natural. That which does not exist is intangible [I.e. A concept] It cannot exist, being logically impossible.

Reality = A / Nature = B | Ergo: A = B, B = A

In order for somthing to cause itself, it must preceed itself. Nothing preceeds itself. Therefore, it is illogical for somthing to cause itself. Q.E.D.

If God exists, that means that it is part of nature. If it's part of nature, it is not supernatural. Also, as something which exists, it cannot be inconsistent. There is nothing that is tangible that is inconsistent.

For example, A being which is omnipotent must be illogical. Can a God make a rock bigger than he can lift? If so, then he would be unable to lift it. If not, he wouldnt be able to create one bigger than he could not lift.

Therefore god would be bound by the laws of logic. I.e., God is a natural entity which had a beginning and cannot do the impossible. A "God" that had a beginning, could not do the impossible, sounds alot like me, a human being. Nor would this God be omniscient, omnipresent... God(s) Can only exist as a concept, like invisible pink unicorns.

Through all of the contradictions in the bibles, and illogical claims, such as Jesus rising from the dead, meaning millions of people worship a 2,000 year old jew zombie nailed to two peices of wood... Magical trees, talking snakes, etc... God simply does not exist.

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?

Why would anyone worship a deity that supposedly has the power to stop 40,000 children from dying of starvation every day, yet doesnt?

It was a picture of a black woman in Northern Africa. They were experiencing a devastating drought. And she was holding her dead baby in her arms and looking up to heaven with the most forlorn expression. I looked at it and thought, "Is it possible to believe that there is a loving or caring Creator when all this woman needed was rain?" [Charles Templeton, former evangelist, referring to a picture in Time Magazine, when asked by Lee Strobel when he realized he lost his faith]

Think of how many people have died for an "all loving" deity... Just in the christian religion alone! The holocaust, the inquisition, crusades, waco texas, salem witch trials, massacre of wounded knee, trail of tears, cortes and montezumo, the list goes on and on.

Were any deities listening to the prayers of a small boy asking for help while he was being molested by a priest?

You must consider that since a casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith proves nothing. It proves everything equally, from 2+2=5 to "God exists because I have faith." It's an inane concept without justification. Two hands working do more than an infinite amount clasped in prayer. "


Thoughts?