Which religion are you?

Yet one person is not whole humanity and for that person their reason is not pathetic. If he/she just can't go on living the way they are it really doesn't matter much what humanity thinks about it. Just my few cents, but I'm not judging people who commit suicide, it's up to them what to do. Worse thing is the environment that made them do that.

 

You double posted private, might wanna edit that out before someone owerup: you to get you further from your goal od a owerdown: of -1337

 

Don't blame it on the environment, people live in a lot worse environments yet live longer lives. It's inside their head that's the real problem.

And I don't care about double post it was a accident.

 

just read everything from the beginning, there are many non religious people like me, i guess it's a sign of changing times in the digital age.

 

I say their both bad! I mean, whats the point of being on this site to get powerdowns? I feel like powering you up for the fun of it! LOL -1337 will never happen

 

I'm a Christian yet a partial atheist.... i got mixed up with all of the current beliefs and the Christian faith

 

Welcome to Psychology 101. I'll be your professor, Bizarro_Paragon. Please take out a pen and paper, and we will begin today's lecture.

For about a decade and a half now, there has been fervent debate in the psychological community regarding whether or not the human psyche. that is, our personality, is made up of principally natural forces, or a result of our environment. That is to say, are we a product of our genetics, or is our behaviour simply a result of the environment we were raised in?

Most leading psychologists believe that the split is roughly 50/50, being larger for some than it is for others. This means that our behaviour, our personality, is made up of 50% our genetics, and 50% how our environment has affected those genetics within the context of our life. This is the leading theory now, and if it not specifically true, then it is certainly close.

Now, how does this relate to depression? For this, we will look at the Massacheusetts Twin Study. This comprehensive study analyzed monozygotic (identical) and dizygotic (non-identical) twins that were raised in different homes, in hopes of gaining more insight on the Nature vs Nurture (Genes vs Environment) debate. When monozygotic twins were subjected to personality tests, it was found that the twins had, on average, an astonishing 80% similarity rate. This was much more than the 50% result of the Dizygotic twins, who would share less genes than the Monozygotic.

For the record:
Monozygotic twins are twins that come from a single zygote, and are thus 100% genetically similar in psychological terms.
Dizygotic twins are twins that come from two zygotes, and are only 50% genetically similar in psychological terms.
What this study proved, concretely, for the first time, was that twins that were raised in completely separate environments would still commonly share traits, passions, diseases, tastes, etc.

In an attempt to expand on this idea, a separate study was performed, analyzing depression rates in Twins. Unsurprisingly, it was found that twins, even those who were separated, would often share traits of depression, and some even have very similar high/low cycles. Specifically, if one monozygotic twin were considered clinically depressed, there was a 45-70% chance that the other would develop clinical depression as well. This is up from the 25-50% chance of dizygotic twins, and from the 5-25% chance of any random person to develop clinical depression.

So, what does this tell us? Well, firstly, it tells us that depression is not strictly a product of our environment. Where one person could become clinically depressed living through a certain scenario, another could live through the same scenario and be comparitively unaffected. Of course, environment will play a factor, but it will not be the deciding one.
Secondly, it tells us that depression is not just a psychological weakness. It is not someone being spineless, or weak, and it is not just "in your head." There is no "problem" with these people. Clinical Depression is an illness, like many others, whose root is seeded deep within our genes.
Being clinically depressed isn't even close to the funk that you go through as a teenager. It's not just a low because your girlfriend dumped you. It's not something that, once you recognize it, you can just brush off and say: "Well, that's enough of THAT." It's a complicated product of genes and environment. People with depression don't, can't, learn to live without depression. It is forever with them. They learn to live in spite of it, they learn to control it. Those who commit suicide are the ones who couldn't.

That's all for today, I will be cutting this class short as I have a Golf reservation at 4:00. There will be a quiz at the start of next class covering chapters 6-10, so I suggest that you refresh your memory of them. See you all on Monday.

P.S. Privateparts, I believe the word you were looking for is "agnostic". Don't quite believe + Don't disbelieve = Agnostic.

Don't believe at all = Atheist.

 

@ Bizarro, very nice post, although I'm not exactly sure what this has to do with religion... I mean, personality does, but that doesn't necessarily determine your religion.

Also, I was under the impression that the "latest" theory (and in high contention with the nature/nurture theory) was the theory of Epigenetics. This is a relatively new area of science in which receptors and methylation is studied in the hopes of determining the way genes are turned on and off.

This is thought to be the cause of differences in twins as it is quite possible, through random methylation and the creating of Barr bodies (in females) that different traits could be expressed because certain chromosomes are shut down while others remain activated.

Take that, Professor!

 

No, it definitely has nothing to do with religion. But the discussion veered off-topic towards suicide, and privateparts had said he couldn't understand why someone would do that, so I figured I would 'splain.

And yes, Epigenetics is the latest theory in the field. But I can assure you it is not in contention with the nature/nurture debate. Nature/Nurture is as much a theory as Gravity is. We know it's there, it's just impossible to prove it.

Epigenetics, though interesting, is nothing more than a sub-category of Nature. Millions of things happen with our genes every minute, and millions of things happen with how we interact with our environment. If, every time we map out one of these things (like we're starting to do with Epigenetics) we have to completely re-define Nature/Nurture, we'll never make any progress.

The fundamental theory will never change. You are a product of your genes (which we do not fully understand) and how you are affected by the environment (which we do not fully understand)

 

@ privateparts: I see where you're getting at, let me just give out something though. Most people really are not that stupid like you said to not run when a flood comes and such, just cuz someone follows a religion, doesn't mean they're going to stand in front of a tsunami until it hits them. The problem that most people have with religion is that they get the idea that just cuz a religion has been established for a large number of years, that it means they can't variate from it. Take me for example...I don't follow any certain religion, what I do is take the values of certain religions and imply it to my own life, however, I take the religion that I have the most stuff that I agree on and say that those are my religions (Buddhism, Catholocism, and some Islam).

Now, religions nowadays are starting to say that they're way isn't just the only way. The Catholic church for example is stating that the Catholic way is just one of many ways toward God, because obviously if God only let a certain group of people in and nothing else, he'd be one favoritistic god. The reason people believed in the first place that their way is the only way is because they misinterpret stuff. Take the Koran for example: Mohammed's never once stated that Islam was the one and only way, in fact, he revered such prophets as Jesus and Moses and at one point. When you hear the phrase "There is no god but God" it's not stating "Islam's God is the only god, all other religions can go f**k off!." What its saying is that there is a God...but a god that reveals himself in different ways. Native Americans wouldn't believe the Jewish way because it just doesn't suit their culture, so God revealed himself to them in a different way that they could understand and get some good out of. Misinterpretation is what causes a lot of the problems and stereotypes of certain religions such as radicals. What I'm saying is just cuz some people of a religion are stupid and close-minded, doesn't mean everyone is, it's the same thing as having an atheist that tells everyone "Your way is stupid, it's my way or no way" Not every atheist is that way, there's just the occasional one.

As for the suicide part...I've always found it quite interesting how some people's views of others get changed by the way they die. Like...let's say someone died of a drug overdoese, people automatically think "Oh they deserved it" even if they were good people in life, or if a firefighter died on the job, people automatically think "He's a hero, I wanna be just like him" even if he was an evil person who abused his wife or such. Not saying that's how you are Privateparts, I'm just stating how it's interesting how the mind works.

 

i remember from middle school that agnostic is the latin or greek for "i don't know"

agnostics are not sure whether god exists

 

Hi I am Bird of Prey and I am from the society to BURN THIS THREAD

 

wow man why do you hate this thread so much?

 

The arguments are getting old. Everyone keeps trying to say I am right and you are wrong because so and so says so.

No one is changing their minds so what's the point (and Privateparts is using it to attack everyone)

 

so just ignore them, and when doesn't privateparts attack someone?

 

My view point, for one, has changed....

Bizarro set me straight on the Epigenetics and Nature vs Nurture area of theories... wasn't aware of the subclass that it had become...

Also some of the discussions about the Theory of Evolution caused me to change my mind a bit. More of a rotation of the ideas than an actual change of opinion, though.

 

As for as I can tell, nobody is trying to change anyone's mind. This isn't a conversion thread. It's a thread to exchange ideas.

Besides, privateparts is defending his points more than anything else. We've just been trained to focus on the negative, so we automatically think he's a jerk.

Oh, and you're welcome, Jon. For more on the Nature vs Nurture debate, I suggest you make your eyes bleed trying to get through the ridiculous length of my new Free Will thread. (BAM! Text Wall!)

 

I've posted some text walls myself. Hopefully tomorrow I'll have some time to look hee hee!

 

Well if people are actually considering others thoughts then it is fine. It just seemed too me that this thread always seems Tobe on the point of total chaos as everyone assaults everyone else's beliefs. I have seen it happen and it isn't pretty. I don;t want to see it happen here.

 

Oh...we've tried religion threads before....the 1st one wasn't pretty The 2nd one was fine, but it only went for about 4 pgs. This one actually is relatively tame, considering how bad it COULD have gotten